View Single Post
Old April 4th, 2010, 09:37 AM
abu ronin's Avatar
abu ronin
Status: Offline
Hookah Master
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: mpls
Posts: 4,498
Send a message via Yahoo to abu ronin
Default Re: Forum Announcement: Regarding **********

Originally Posted by shawnwhyte View Post
Alright, well, even though my opinion really means nothing to anyone, I feel I should share it.

I've looked into this earlier today, taking in as much information about the situation as I could find, and after the rest of the day, and a few beers, it's sunk in pretty well.

Whether it be HP vs HJ or SamB vs HJ... there is no winner in this fight. Only losers. A lot of them actually, as all the losers are us, the customer and general forum user. I have no strong pull in either direction on this issue, and as someone in the middle, all I can think about it how much of a loss this is for the consumers of the site. I feel that all vendors should have the ability to join in normal discussions with forum members, and each vendor has a specialized name saying they are a vendor so distinguishing between vendors and members is not difficult at all, and I feel that it is an insult to my intelligence thinking that one vendors opinion could alter ordering plans. And even using the review section as a point of reference, I never trust them 100% because of course it is all opinion, but when taking in many many opinions, they form something that is more factual, so if 20 people say one thing about a product, and 2 say the opposite, odds are the majority will have it.

But I also feel, that if vendors are not permitted to be active members and share opinions, that that should apply to those who are in a position of authority, whether it be moderator or admin. The title alone could mislead new hookah smokers to listen to you over other members who may have just as much, or even more experience in this area than them. Vendors are here, and exist, because they are passionate about hookah. You moderators are here and in your position because you are passionate about hookah. We are all here reading this, concerned about the future of the site, because we are passionate about hookah.

This all just seems to be a clash of egos to me. I am not defending John, nor am I defending HP, but I believe 100% that this is a complete disservice to the consumers, and mainly the new consumers just finding this site or who will in the near future, as John has always had a great selection of products, good service, and the whole nine yards. Though there are many other great vendors here on this site, banning one of the favorite vendors here (not saying he is my favorite) for infractions, that frankly seem way blown out of proportion, seems ridiculous.

And though I don't agree with how John spoke about Social Smoke shisha, if worded better and in less of a rush to be written, I feel like his point would have been driven home better. The same point that normal members brought up in the same thread, or similar threads, about the validity of the claims of made in America shisha,

Well there was my completely unbiased review of the situation. Now it is off the bed because this alcohol is starting to make my head hurt.
Shawn, you make some good points. But the thing is ,yes, when vendors are allowed to interact in the general forum we better for it. And 99% of the time that's true. But the problem is, when a vendor takes advantage of that privelige, and it IS a privelige, to use the general discussion to push products and attack the cmpetition then it becomes unfair to all the other vendors, especially those w/good intentions who play by the rules. It also has the potential to create a burst of self promoting by vendors which could turn this race into soethng it was never intended to be. We're working on policies that will adress this issue, but when vendors push the envelope in such a way as HJ has is has to stop. Us banning HJ has not made it difficult for members. HJ's acton have made it difficult because he forced our hand and brought it to this.