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Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

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  #1  
Old October 21st, 2008, 12:53 PM
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Default Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Hello,
I have a question that I don't know anywhere else to ask. My neighbor is an Egyptian Christian. I don't know much about Egypt or any cultural issues there. It was pointed out to me recently by an Ethiopian friend of mine that sometimes Christians in Ethiopia abstain from Hookahs because of perceived ties to Muslim religion. Some are quite offended by it for that reason. My question is this. Will I offend my neighbor if I smoke my hookah on the porch. Obviously this is somewhat an individual issue and would be a case by case question but I am wondering if there is an overwhelming cultural thing I should be sensitive to. It wouldn't be an issue except that I have a pretty strong rule about no smoking in the house. I have tried to live by it and I have expected others to but if I need to I can make a hookah exception for the sake of Neighbor relations.

Not trying to start any kind of religious debate or anything just trying to be sensitive to the cultural and possibly specifically cultural issues at hand. Mainly I don't want to insult or offend him.
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  #2  
Old October 21st, 2008, 01:32 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

I'm not Egyptian and I am not an expert on much of anything but I have spent a great deal of time in Arabic countries and Iran and know a bit about the cultural side of narghiles so I think I can answer this. First of all narghiles are not in anyway Islamic and as a matter of fact most Islamic religious authorities condemn all forms of tobacco consumption. I will also point out that narghile use may have started on the Indian subcontient and it's wildly popular in India today inspite of government efforts to stamp it out.

As to Christians a visit to Armenia or any of the Christian enclaves in near by nations will alert one to the fact that smoking tombac from a narghile is quite common. I would think that the position of your Egyptian friend is a result of the current religious strife afflicting Egypt rathr then some concern based in Christian Orthodox or Coptic doctrine. The Egyptian Christians I have known don't associate narghile use with religion which is sensible because it is not a religious ritual. Lastly, I am not aware of any doctrinal declaration from any Christian church leader on the subjcet of narghile use so for a Christian to be religiously offended by you smoking one seems irrational.

Bottom line, I doubt your neighbors have any reaon to be offended by you smoking on your porch but if they are they are the ones being unreasonable.

Last edited by Hajo Flettner; October 21st, 2008 at 01:38 PM.
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  #3  
Old October 21st, 2008, 01:43 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

To answer your question of it being offensive, I think not. I am Christian Lebanese and you will definately not offend anyone in my background with hookah use, in fact it would be a great icebreaker in making friends. With that being said, some Christian Egyptians I know are orthodox and very strict with aspects to their religion, more than other Middle Eastern Christians. You can always feel free to ask them since not all people of any religion act the either the way the are supposed to or the way you would perceive them to. Just go ahead and say hi, ask them if they smoke, or just light up. I assume you live in the US, it's a free country and I'm sure they understand that. I think you are worried too much, and you may make some good friends/neighbors out of this, good luck.
John
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  #4  
Old October 21st, 2008, 01:49 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Cool. No the only reason I ask is because I have several Ethiopian friends who seem to view it not as a rite but as more a part of that culture. Interestingly enough though it seems to be a fairly new development there. It might even be localized there or more to the point localized with a few that live here. I know it isn't a religious thing, obviously but a cultural thing. Good to know there aren't any cultural things to worry about. I thought it was odd because from what I have read of Egypt one of the main reasons they became one of the major hubs of Hookahs was because it was so universal there.

Interesting history there. Thanks.
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  #5  
Old October 21st, 2008, 01:57 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ************* View Post
To answer your question of it being offensive, I think not. I am Christian Lebanese and you will definately not offend anyone in my background with hookah use, in fact it would be a great icebreaker in making friends. With that being said, some Christian Egyptians I know are orthodox and very strict with aspects to their religion, more than other Middle Eastern Christians. You can always feel free to ask them since not all people of any religion act the either the way the are supposed to or the way you would perceive them to. Just go ahead and say hi, ask them if they smoke, or just light up. I assume you live in the US, it's a free country and I'm sure they understand that. I think you are worried too much, and you may make some good friends/neighbors out of this, good luck.
John
Thanks. Again very useful information. I don't believe they are Orthodox but I could be wrong. I really thought they were Catholic but we haven't talked much about it. I don't think he would say anything about it even if he was offended by it but having had experience with several other cultures you learn that somethings come across as rude that I don't always catch. I mean here we don't have any etiquette or rules surrounding Hookahs. I never would have thought that there was any kind of mindset about it. To me it is just a cool looking better smoking pipe that generally has flavored wet tobacco in it. Apparently there are some communities that see it differently. Just making sure.
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  #6  
Old October 21st, 2008, 01:58 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

I agree highly with John's statement. I was raised Christian but have a Syrian/American background so I've been exposed to Islam as well. I for one saw a lot of thoughtfulness in your post and that shows great character my friend . Along with what John said, there is an easy way to confirm your question. Simply go and say hi to your neighbour, be polite, and kindly ask if they would be bothered with your use of the hookah. I'm sure all will be fine, so no need to worry. Salaam,

- Mohamed
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  #7  
Old October 21st, 2008, 02:56 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezzik View Post
Hello,
I have a question that I don't know anywhere else to ask. My neighbor is an Egyptian Christian. I don't know much about Egypt or any cultural issues there. It was pointed out to me recently by an Ethiopian friend of mine that sometimes Christians in Ethiopia abstain from Hookahs because of perceived ties to Muslim religion. Some are quite offended by it for that reason. My question is this. Will I offend my neighbor if I smoke my hookah on the porch. Obviously this is somewhat an individual issue and would be a case by case question but I am wondering if there is an overwhelming cultural thing I should be sensitive to. It wouldn't be an issue except that I have a pretty strong rule about no smoking in the house. I have tried to live by it and I have expected others to but if I need to I can make a hookah exception for the sake of Neighbor relations.

Not trying to start any kind of religious debate or anything just trying to be sensitive to the cultural and possibly specifically cultural issues at hand. Mainly I don't want to insult or offend him.
You have come to the right place.

I am an Egyptian Muslim, but let me tell u this.

In Egypt, hookah has definitely NOTHING to do with religion.

It is not tied to Muslims.

Actually Muslims who are strictly following do not smoke hookah because anything that is harmful to you or others is a sin in Islam.

Btw, my preferred vendor for tobacco and coals is christian, I knew because of the large cross he has in display in his shop. Hookah is a cultural not a religious thing, just like Falafel or any Egyptian Dish.....

Actually u might give ur neighbor nostalgia because he will feel home sickness when he sees u smoking ... Invite him to share with you if he smokes hookah (btw, Egyptians call the Hookah "shisha", here shisha means the device not the tobacco).... Ask him to smoke shisha with you and if he smokes it it will be a good ice breaker and u can build on that.

On a side note, these Ethiopeans friends of yours do not know anything about Islam or Egyptian culture. Period!
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  #8  
Old October 21st, 2008, 03:02 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

btw, there is etiquette with hookah, they will be glad to teach you too, and first like The Egyptian said, they refer to hookah as shisha, the actual pipe
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  #9  
Old October 21st, 2008, 03:08 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ************* View Post
btw, there is etiquette with hookah, they will be glad to teach you too, and first like The Egyptian said, they refer to hookah as shisha, the actual pipe

Etiquette is:

1- never hog the hose
2- Never point the hose at the person when u pass it to them, either put it down, or hand it to the person with the tip not facing them.
3- Always have smalltalk while smoking, it is nice and it makes the session more enjoyable.

That is it ! Easy, isn't it?
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  #10  
Old October 21st, 2008, 03:17 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Yeah I knew it was called Shisha. I went into a store here recently just inquiring on the prices of some they had and they looked at me funny when I asked to see their Hookahs. LOL> Not sure where they were from so I don't know what to call it there. Yeah I had heard that about Egypt but I wanted to be sure cause I had heard it on the internet and sometimes information gets stale on the internet.

The Ethiopians admitted to not knowing much about Egyptian culture mostly it was a friend's fiancee talking about their culture. I think perhaps there is somewhat of a political problem in that instance. I just wondered if there was something along those lines that I should be aware of.

I asked him about hookahs once and he said he doesn't smoke anything, and we only had one conversation about religion. Figure I will just leave that at that.
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  #11  
Old October 21st, 2008, 03:18 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ************* View Post
btw, there is etiquette with hookah, they will be glad to teach you too, and first like The Egyptian said, they refer to hookah as shisha, the actual pipe
I had read that. Some of it is very general but there are some practices that are somewhat regional as well.
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  #12  
Old October 21st, 2008, 03:21 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Egyptian View Post
Etiquette is:

1- never hog the hose
2- Never point the hose at the person when u pass it to them, either put it down, or hand it to the person with the tip not facing them.
3- Always have smalltalk while smoking, it is nice and it makes the session more enjoyable.

That is it ! Easy, isn't it?
Sounds pretty easy. Isn't there something about if you are renting one that you are supposed to lay the hose a certain way to signify that you are completely done. Like hang it or lay it flat or point it toward the hookah or toward the bar or something not sure what it was. They don't seem to notice one way or another where we go.
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  #13  
Old October 21st, 2008, 03:26 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezzik View Post
Yeah I knew it was called Shisha. I went into a store here recently just inquiring on the prices of some they had and they looked at me funny when I asked to see their Hookahs. LOL> Not sure where they were from so I don't know what to call it there. Yeah I had heard that about Egypt but I wanted to be sure cause I had heard it on the internet and sometimes information gets stale on the internet.

The Ethiopians admitted to not knowing much about Egyptian culture mostly it was a friend's fiancee talking about their culture. I think perhaps there is somewhat of a political problem in that instance. I just wondered if there was something along those lines that I should be aware of.

I asked him about hookahs once and he said he doesn't smoke anything, and we only had one conversation about religion. Figure I will just leave that at that.


Let's just leave it at that some African nations are not very much in love with their fellow African nation named Egypt .....

And let's just leave it at that Egypt threatened to use military forces against any nation that tries to cut Egypt's supply of the nile river water and to violate the treatie signed decades ago ... and Ethiopea is one of the countries where the Nile sources start, while Egypt is the last station for the river before it hits the Mediterranean sea, so they can cut our supply and we can do nothing about it ... And Nile is our one and only source of water so it is national security.
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  #14  
Old October 21st, 2008, 03:28 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezzik View Post
Sounds pretty easy. Isn't there something about if you are renting one that you are supposed to lay the hose a certain way to signify that you are completely done. Like hang it or lay it flat or point it toward the hookah or toward the bar or something not sure what it was. They don't seem to notice one way or another where we go.
You could roll it once around the hookah then hang the tip in that circle, or leave it at the ash tray (unless there are coals that can scorch it) or at ur table
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  #15  
Old October 21st, 2008, 03:31 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Ah thank you kind sir.
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  #16  
Old October 21st, 2008, 04:02 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Ethiopia is currently involved in an occupational war instigated by the U.S. against Somalia as well as an on going conflict that flairs into open war periodically against Eritrea and various ethnic groups within Ethiopia that are religiously Muslim. You may want to keep that in mind when talking to Ethiopians about Muslims, Egypt or the Arab world in general.
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  #17  
Old October 21st, 2008, 04:35 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

He was rather vague something about when he lived there it wasn't so bad but between him coming here and her coming things changed. Apparently a balance of power shift that drove a wedge between the two communities that didn't need to be there.

Anyway I was just making sure that it was more isolated and that it wouldn't be as big a deal as it was to this girl.
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  #18  
Old October 21st, 2008, 07:23 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

one thing i didnt see mentioned in the basic etiquette that i have heard and follow more just because it is better for me than anything else is that hookahs should sit on the floor unless they are rather small and then they can go on a table.

i just keep my 32 inch hookah on the floor so i can see the tv/friends/ and there is less distance if it tips for any reason

i have a friend who is Pakistani by heritage and muslim and we always have the discussion of shsisha/hookah/tobacco, he calls the pipe shisha i call it hookah, he calls it tobacco i call it shisha. i do my best to try and say tobacco and shisha when around him as to not confuse the conversation. but also with the muslim thing his parents dont like that he smoked hookah, yet his grandparents smoked hookah all the time, (but his dad is a very religious person in their faith, he doesnt really know how to explain it to me but he keeps saying hes kind of like a priest so his parents are very devout muslims, he is as well, just doesnt follow the hookah= bad)

-matt
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  #19  
Old October 22nd, 2008, 09:01 AM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Funny thing about that. The first time we went to this place they put it on the floor. However, that was the owner who is from the Middle East somewhere or his family is anyway. I believe he has only been there once when we were smoking the hookah so that was the only time it was done that way. The other times it was set up by either the cook or the Ethiopian guy and it has always been on the table since then. 32" Hookah I believe because it is above my head when it is on the table. When I stand I am basically eye to eye with the coals. I would like it on the floor better if the table were turned the other way and we could recline a little. We like to watch the bubbles and occasionally to learn more about the physics I suck all the smoke out slowly to keep it from refilling. I couldn't see the effect of that when it was on the floor. LOL.

I am glad this has sparked so much discussion. I appreciate all the advice.
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  #20  
Old October 22nd, 2008, 09:37 AM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Egyptian View Post
Let's just leave it at that some African nations are not very much in love with their fellow African nation named Egypt .....
oh well, theres that damn you guys built that just so happened to piss off your neighbor to the south a lot...something about a high dam flooding the northern part of the country....haha jp w/ you

Im surprised that people think its a Muslim thing.

I will put the smaller hookahs on a table of some sort, like a coffee table or something, just for ease in adjustment, taller hookahs, always on the floor.

I call it a shisha/arghileh....ill call the tobacco moassel/tobacco...and shisha sometimes.
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Old October 22nd, 2008, 09:59 AM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by photolinger View Post
oh well, theres that damn you guys built that just so happened to piss off your neighbor to the south a lot...something about a high dam flooding the northern part of the country....haha jp w/ you

Im surprised that people think its a Muslim thing.

I will put the smaller hookahs on a table of some sort, like a coffee table or something, just for ease in adjustment, taller hookahs, always on the floor.

I call it a shisha/arghileh....ill call the tobacco moassel/tobacco...and shisha sometimes.
I wondered how wide spread that attitude was. Apparently not very. LOL.

I find it odd that Hookahs have so many different names and yet Hookah doesn't seem to be one of them. Where does the term Hookah come from? I only see Moassel here I did a google search and there are very few references outside of this forum. The only thing I can figure out is it must be a transliteration. I typically call the pipe a Hookah and the tobacco Shisha but mostly because that is how it was introduced to me. I will probably keep that up even though I think if I were to do it differently it would be Shisha and tobacco or Shisha tobacco.

Is Hookah an American term?
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  #22  
Old October 22nd, 2008, 12:50 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

i believe the word comes from india
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  #23  
Old October 22nd, 2008, 12:51 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

I very little about sub-Saharan Africa outside of the South & the Horn so I'd want more info about the water disputes before saying much about it.

As to the term hookah I don't know where that word comes from although I think (not sure) that in India it's called a huqu but the terms I am used to hearing are narghile, arquile narquile, shisha and Lule while the Iranians have a different term that I can't recall off hand. Personally I prefer the term narghile as that how it was introduced to me and I like the way it sounds. In the end they all mean the same thing although I don't perosnally like the term hookah.

As to tobacco moassel (or some veriant in spelling) is pretty common although outside the West jurak and tombac are common and tobamel less so. Calling the tobacco shisha I think is basically an American thing.
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  #24  
Old October 22nd, 2008, 12:53 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by photolinger View Post
oh well, theres that damn you guys built that just so happened to piss off your neighbor to the south a lot...something about a high dam flooding the northern part of the country....haha jp w/ you

Im surprised that people think its a Muslim thing.

I will put the smaller hookahs on a table of some sort, like a coffee table or something, just for ease in adjustment, taller hookahs, always on the floor.

I call it a shisha/arghileh....ill call the tobacco moassel/tobacco...and shisha sometimes.
We are the last station right before the water goes to waste (i.e.: mediterranean sea) so if we build dams it is our business coz we won't constrict anyone's stream or supply. The dam did nothing to Sudan, plus Sudan is a brotherly nation with brotherly relations (my cousin was part of the UN peacekeeping mission in Sudan and he was killed there btw) ...



Quote:
Originally Posted by Fezzik View Post
I wondered how wide spread that attitude was. Apparently not very. LOL.

I find it odd that Hookahs have so many different names and yet Hookah doesn't seem to be one of them. Where does the term Hookah come from? I only see Moassel here I did a google search and there are very few references outside of this forum. The only thing I can figure out is it must be a transliteration. I typically call the pipe a Hookah and the tobacco Shisha but mostly because that is how it was introduced to me. I will probably keep that up even though I think if I were to do it differently it would be Shisha and tobacco or Shisha tobacco.

Is Hookah an American term?
Hookah is originally an Arabic word ... Huqqa which was transliterated into English as Hookah which is easier to pronounce for the western tongues than the original word. Huqqah meant Little bottle...
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Old October 22nd, 2008, 01:39 PM
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Default Re: Cultural question for my Egyptian friends.

Groovy. Wealth of information on this thread. Thanks. I love how you guys are so great about answering questions.
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