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Herbal Shishas

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  #1  
Old July 5th, 2009, 12:55 PM
kkentert
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Default Herbal Shishas

Hey guys-
So I've been doing as much reseacrh as I can here on herbal shishas, and it seems like Saalaam Herbal and Hydro Herbal Shisha are getting pretty good reviews for herbals. But here is my question. Both say it looks like pine needles, and the marketing for both claim to be tobacco and nicotine free, but neither claim to be tar free. Is it possible they do use pine needles? I'm a beekeeper and I use pine needles in my smoker because they put out a REALLY THICK, nice smelling white smoke. My problem though is that pine puts out an incredible amount of tar when it burns. So are those two in fact just as bad or worse for you than tobacco?

Next is the Black Lable Herbal Shisha. They do claim to be tobacco, nicotine and tar free, but it seems to have really bad reviews.

Are there any herbals that are GOOD and claim to be TAR FREE as well?
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  #2  
Old July 5th, 2009, 12:57 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Its splintered sugar cane and it has yet to be determined if it is even healthier than tobacco.

Do you have an aversion to nicotine or do you just want to try something new?
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  #3  
Old July 5th, 2009, 01:44 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

bottom line is smoke is smoke, and smoke in general is bad for you regaurdless of what it is, so while it may not have nicotine its still not good for you.
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  #4  
Old July 5th, 2009, 01:55 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

I believe Soex herbal shisha has 0% nicotine, 0% tar, and 0% tobacco. I've had the citrus flavor a long while back ago and it tasted pretty damn good, and that was before when I first started hookah so I didn't know much but now since I am more experience with hookah I feel like I can get it to taste and smoke better.
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  #5  
Old July 5th, 2009, 02:25 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

like the people above said
it still hasnt been proven that there is no tar in hookah smoke
however i (and a bunch of other people) strongly believe that since there is no actual combustion there should be none
either way theres no healthy smoke.
oh and i think shein is right about the sugar cane
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  #6  
Old July 5th, 2009, 02:28 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

I think I heard somewhere that Hydro had no Begasse in it. Not sure where though.

Most Herbal Molasses is Begasse though.
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  #7  
Old July 5th, 2009, 02:41 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Smoking Herbal concoctions from your hookah is like eating a tofu filet Mignon , its only good to those few twisted individuals that actually convince themselves its the same taste/experience.

If there are no personal convictions against nicotine id say dont even bother with herbal "tobacco". It's too new to fully understand health risks from it, and its just plain weird not getting any sensation from smoking.

If you are afraid of nicotine addiction or have no desire to be addicted then DONT SMOKE anything. nothing. Find a hobby that doesnt revolve around what you are trying to avoid.

It's like aspiring to be a pilot, but you hate planes so you want an alternative travel method. Well, you cant fly a train so I guess your SOL haha. Why bother man.

Last edited by Shienhausser; July 5th, 2009 at 03:06 PM.
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  #8  
Old July 5th, 2009, 05:04 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

I tried the the hydro it's kind of like flavored air.
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  #9  
Old July 5th, 2009, 05:20 PM
Hajo Flettner
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Every single "shisha" that diesn't have tobacco uses used, shredded sugar cane as a base. While some have better flavours then others they all have little to no smoke texture and they all leave a film in your mouth since they are all literally swimming in glycerin. Whys smoke something with no texture? It's like ebaygirl says "its flavoured air".

There is nothing herbal about "hermbal shishas" and since a shisha is a pipe the marketing annoys me. Frankly I can't see why anyone thinks thats glycerin + flavourings + honey + spent sugar cane is less gdangerous then glycerin + flavourings + honey + tobacco.

As to nicotine I don't see what the big deal is since unless you smoke tombac you don't get much of the nicotine content from moassel since it's not literally burned.

I went to the Dr. recently to have my latest skin graft checked and get a check up. The doctor checked my cardio-vascular condition and said it's normal for someone my age and the blood test conclueded that I am not a smoker which is interesting since I smoke my narghile daily and have a cigar a couple of times a week. I guess that should tell you something about how nicotine in moassel is absorted into the bloodstream. Also, I smoke mostly traditional stuff which has more nicotine then the mod washed stuff.
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  #10  
Old July 5th, 2009, 09:08 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

i once smoked some herbal shisha and it looked like old leaves that you would find on the ground, after one session i through it out
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  #11  
Old July 5th, 2009, 11:17 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Herbal sucks, smoking is bad for you...period, end of story. So if your going to smoke you mind as well smoke tobacco.
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  #12  
Old July 5th, 2009, 11:47 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

I smoke both Saalaam and Hydro almost exclusively. They both contain bagasse. No pine needles. The bagasse does look something like pine needles in shape but not in color and certainly not in taste. That would be an unmistakeable taste.

No tar is added to herbal shishas (or regular shisha, as far as I know) but tar is a byproduct. While shisha doesn't get properly burned, there's no telling just how hot shisha has to get before tar is produced. The scientific studies say tar is produced from it, but they don't mention at what temperature they burned/baked the shisha. I can say that there's always SOME burned shisha in my bowl when I'm done.

As to the taste of the herbal, I love it. Not all of it, but several of the flavors are quite nice and very satisfying. I've smoke it with other tobacco shisha lovers who didn't complain a bit about the taste.

It produces nice, thick clouds and is full of flavor, depending on the flavor that is. I've smoked a couple of flavors that didn't have much taste to me at all.

I do not wish to become addicted to nicotine again. I don't get a "hangover" from herbal shisha but I definitely get one from tobacco shisha. Tobacco shisha is harsher on my throat as well.

Is one healthier than the other? Probably not. It's never healthy to sit around purposefully inhaling smoke. But my personal choice is to stick with the herbal blends to avoid addiction and the hangover. Besides, I LIKE what I'm smoking and have no desire to fix what ain't broke.
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  #13  
Old July 6th, 2009, 12:30 AM
kkentert
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Thanks to everyone who responded!!!

You guys ahve a great forum with nice active members.... Anyway........

So I don't think I have a big problem with the nicotine....(and I don't really think the nicotine is the worst part of smoking) It's mainly the tar things, as that's what coats you're lungs.

I guess the answer is this (since I'm not really going to be smoking myself-though I do LOVE the smell of hookahs around me)
I'll get some herbals, I'll get some tobaccos and let whoever is smoking choose.

Thanks again for all the imput!
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  #14  
Old July 6th, 2009, 12:33 AM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Sorry- one more question. Does anyone know how many grams are used in a normal smoking session?

I'm seeing a lot of 50g Jars of herbal shisha, but then there are 100g, 250g etc. Also looks like there are 15g "shots." So does that mean a normal session uses about 50g?

Just wondering how much I need to buy.
Thanks!
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  #15  
Old July 6th, 2009, 04:36 AM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Nicotine is not technically bad for you. Its is the addictive element. But I believe it depends if you have an addictive personallity. Salaam and I believe all herbal are sugarcane. I say you don't live forever so go for it. As for the other question I have a deep bowl so I would say I use about 15-25 grams per session depending on what it is and how long I want to smoke. I don't know who is using 50 grams per session out there but... good luck to them
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  #16  
Old July 6th, 2009, 11:28 AM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Right now, Saalaam and Hydro Herbal are only sold in 50 gram packages. If you are wanting to sample several different types of any type of shisha, 50 grams is a good place to start. From a 50 gram container, you can get several smoking sessions (as many as 5 sessions if they are short sessions but more likely around 3 sessions using your average bowl), depending on how much you put in the bowl and how big the bowl itself is.

You can buy "hookah" shots as well. They don't have them in the herbals, I don't think, but you can buy a big box of single "shot" samplers to taste test a lot of flavors.

You also have the option of blending the various shishas you have. If you get a flavor you don't like, you might find it's simply wonderful when you combine it with another flavor.

Last edited by Genie; July 6th, 2009 at 12:42 PM. Reason: A duh moment.
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  #17  
Old July 7th, 2009, 10:07 PM
kkentert
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

OK, here's what I'm getting-Let me know if you think this is a good start-

Hookah-
Sahara Sub-Zero Hookah BLUE
Height: 29"
Stem: Sahara Stem with Autoseal system
Hose: 3 matching Synthetic
Bowl: Ceramic
Vase: Sahara Sub-Zero - available in: Blue


TOBACCO:
Fantasia Pink Lemonade
Al Fahker Golden Eskandarani Apple
Hookah-Hookah - Tropical Punch
Hookah-Hookah - Lemonade

THANKS!

HERBAL
Hydro Grape
Saalaam herbal key lime pie
Saalaam herbal Tiramisu

Last edited by kkentert; July 7th, 2009 at 10:17 PM.
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  #18  
Old July 7th, 2009, 10:21 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Well, i occasionally will mix Saalaam Herbal because Spiced Chai is a really nice flavor. But, i really dont buy most of the things about hookah being bad for you. Most studies have either scorched the tobacco, or just assumed it was being burned like a ciggarettes tobacco into an ash. Tar is released when some plant material is burned (depends on the plant), shisha tobacco is just "toasted". Therefore less tar will be released, and since the water cools down the smoke, it is easier for particles in the smoke to be filtered out. The particles will be moving slower and will easily drop into the water, along with some flavoring in the smoke hence the tainted water once your done smoking, even if you have a phunnel or a vortex which captures almost all of the juices. Most of the studies just dont add up. But, there is CO in the smoke, depending on your coal there could be more or less (coconaras have a very low CO rate). Well thats my rant on tobacco.

Now, herbal is a weird subject. The only way to test if you actually breathe in bagasse is to test the water for it, and test the smoke coming out of the hose. If bagasse is in the water, then we know that it is released from the herbal mixture, Then we could take steps to ensure more filtering of the smoke to increase the amount of bagasse trapped ie, diffuser, deeper downstem, ect. If bagasse is found in the smoke, then we really shouldnt smoke herbal shisha unless there is some non-bagasse version.

Unfortunately, this is one of my only free summers for a few years to come, and i dont have the tools or the knowledge to fufill these tests. But someone who does should try this out as it would be really important to hookah smokers worldwide.
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  #19  
Old July 7th, 2009, 10:41 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Quote:
Originally Posted by kkentert View Post
OK, here's what I'm getting-Let me know if you think this is a good start-
Don't forget the coals, mah boi. Also the AF Golden Esk Apple is delicious. Good choice.
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  #20  
Old July 7th, 2009, 11:51 PM
kkentert
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

I don't know what bagasse is!

And Ah yes...the coals. Should I get the coconaras that Coldgr33ntea said to get for the lower CO?
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  #21  
Old July 7th, 2009, 11:54 PM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Quote:
Originally Posted by kkentert View Post
I don't know what bagasse is!

And Ah yes...the coals. Should I get the coconaras that Coldgr33ntea said to get for the lower CO?
Bagasse is found in the dust from cane sugar. People who work in the cane sugar fields and breathe that in are very likey to develop something that i dont remember what its called. Pulmonary fibrosis? idk whatever

But that doesnt sound like something that you should smoke, and its very possible that you might be able to breathe it in in the smoke.

and yes, coconaras are the shiznit. If you do some searching, one of the users tested the level of CO in the air when lighting the coals and smoking it. Coconaras were the lowest, and exotica coals were much much higher in the amount of CO that they give off.
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  #22  
Old July 8th, 2009, 12:06 AM
kkentert
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Cool. Good to know! Thanks!

Sounds like tobacco may be safer! I guess I can test for tar simply by putting some cotton in the mouthpiece and seeing just how dirty it gets...

I agree about Nicotine...I don't think it causes many health problems. I think it's the added chemicals and tar in cigs. that are bad.
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  #23  
Old July 8th, 2009, 12:32 AM
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Default Re: Herbal Shishas

Wow, I'm reading a lot of justifications here. But I'm not going to fool myself into thinking that either type of shisha is healthier.

For one thing, it's not strictly bagasse dust they put in herbal shisha. A better world for it would really be sugarcane fiber, the pulp that's left after the sugar is extracted. There's agave and beet bagasse too. Bagasse just means the pulp that's left over after extraction from products used to make sugar.

Just because breathing sugarcane bagasse dust is harmful doesn't mean that smoking it will cause the same problems. And the dust that's in those factories, can you imagine?! There are health risks in breathing sawdust and concrete dust too, some are quite serious.

Like breathing smoke, *******ally breathing massive amounts of dust from anything just isn't healthy.

Dust particles and smoke are not the same thing. And if sugarcane bagasse were so harmful, you wouldn't be able to walk into the grocery store and buy a stick of whole sugarcane to chew on or to cut up and use in your own food prep. I've been sorely tempted to buy some and see what I'd have to do to pulverize it into something I could transform into shisha.
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